19-02-2021, 10:49 PM
11
Re: Free speech at university?
Originally Posted by Surfermom
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Yes, they do. It'a s real shocker, isn't it 
.
I'd argue that the former is a very basic level of education, mainly found at primary education establishments.
The latter is the sort of learning and experience one would hope to instil at higher levels of education and research, especially at PhD level.
And I understood that America has some of the very best universities, some even more highly regarded than Oxford and Cambridge.
19-02-2021, 10:52 PM
12
Re: Free speech at university?
When I was in Uni (as a mature student in my 30's), we were encouraged to argue against the books, against the lecturers. This was the way to encourage critical thinking, create debate, encourage conversation. To simply agree with what was put in front of you, was regarded as lazy.
19-02-2021, 10:57 PM
15
Re: Free speech at university?
Originally Posted by spitfire
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Laziness is everywhere, folks can't be arsed at all levels.
19-02-2021, 11:05 PM
16
Re: Free speech at university?
Originally Posted by JBR
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Do these professors hope to encourage their students to agree with their own statements, or to learn to think for themselves?I'd argue that the former is a very basic level of education, mainly found at primary education establishments.
The latter is the sort of learning and experience one would hope to instil at higher levels of education and research, especially at PhD level.
And I understood that America has some of the very best universities, some even more highly regarded than Oxford and Cambridge.
Certainly there are professors who, with even a modicum of understanding ethics and philosophy, understand that taking the opposing view has many merits - including affirmation of a stance, sealing up holes, creating new hypotheses, becoming better at rhetoric, etc.
Even so, there are more than a few who get so caught up in their own sanctimonious ideology that the classroom becomes a pulpit.
My son, adopted from Russia and thus a proponent of adoption-before-abortion, had to go to his dean (at a highly regarded university) about being downgraded for not being more pro-abortion. He said that on more than one occasion the professor went into near meltdown in class for disagreeing with him. My son won the dispute and the exam grade was changed, though I am unsure about what the outcome was with the professor.
19-02-2021, 11:05 PM
17
Re: Free speech at university?
Originally Posted by spitfire
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Laziness is everywhere, folks can't be arsed at all levels.
As far as their students are concerned, university is a place where they can enjoy themselves pratting about and getting drunk for three or four years. They're given a grant to allow them to do this which, of course, they'll never have to repay as they're never likely to obtain a job with a sufficient salary.
What an absolute waste! Thank you Tony B Liar.
19-02-2021, 11:06 PM
18
Re: Free speech at university?
Originally Posted by surfermom
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you would hope so, but it isn't always the case.Certainly there are professors who, with even a modicum of understanding ethics and philosophy, understand that taking the opposing view has many merits - including affirmation of a stance, sealing up holes, creating new hypotheses, becoming better at rhetoric, etc.
Even so, there are more than a few who get so caught up in their own sanctimonious ideology that the classroom becomes a pulpit. My son, adopted from russia and thus a proponent of adoption-before-adoption, had to go to his dean (at a highly regarded university) about being downgraded for not being more pro-abortion. He said that on more than one occasion the professor went into near meltdown in class for disagreeing with him. my son won the argument
19-02-2021, 11:06 PM
19
Re: Free speech at university?
Originally Posted by JBR
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Many universities in this country these days exist almost solely on the basis of their Mickey Mouse degrees!As far as their students are concerned, university is a place where they can enjoy themselves pratting about and getting drunk for three or four years. They're given a grant to allow them to do this which, of course, they'll never have to repay as they're never likely to obtain a job with a sufficient salary.
What an absolute waste! Thank you Tony B Liar.
20-02-2021, 02:35 AM
20
Re: Free speech at university?
Originally Posted by JBR
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Many universities in this country these days exist almost solely on the basis of their Mickey Mouse degrees!As far as their students are concerned, university is a place where they can enjoy themselves pratting about and getting drunk for three or four years. They're given a grant to allow them to do this which, of course, they'll never have to repay as they're never likely to obtain a job with a sufficient salary.
What an absolute waste! Thank you Tony B Liar.
Maybe you could explain what a "mickey mouse degree" is? Is that something peculiar to Britain?..Honest question. I have never studied there. I have visited Oxford, Cambridge and Bath Universties. I must say I never saw a lot of goofing off there. Only people tearing around looking vert busy and stressed.
On the subject of freedom of speech, I know what people mean here. And I agree that a university should be a place where freedom of expression and speech reign supreme. Places where regardless of the content of your speech, work and writings, you will be listened to without being "Cancelled"..Then you will be argued with, agreed with, have your words dissected or in fact ridiculed. But you will be able to speak. UNiversity is where I first read Voltaire. I reads Micromégas and Plato's Dream to get a headache and Candide for fun. I mention him because one of his most famous quotes is..."I disagree violently with what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it" Sadly not many people are into Voltaire these days.
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